(Dismissed) WASC Secondary Seats Act Discussion

UnitedStatesOfScouting Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:04 am

Greetings WASC Members,

With the new "WASC Secondary Seats Act", any Secondary Seat Holder may elect to vote as soon as possible without even consulting their Primary Seat Holder, when they vote the Primary Seat Holder is automatically deprived of their vote with the current language of the law. I feel that this is unjust to the Primary Seat Holder. I believe that each seat holder may issue their vote, but only the only occasion where the Secondary Seat Holder's vote is recognized is when the Primary Seat Holder's vote remains as pending, and as such would allow for the Secondary Vote to count.

Before I jump to drafting up any legislature, I'd like to consult with the Governing Body on this topic, as it's something we need to discuss and suggest possible course(s) of action should we agree this needs to be changed.

Therefore this topic is now an open discussion to members of the WASC.

Shockwave Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:11 am

UnitedStatesOfScouting wrote:Greetings WASC Members,

With the new "WASC Secondary Seats Act", any Secondary Seat Holder may elect to vote as soon as possible without even consulting their Primary Seat Holder, when they vote the Primary Seat Holder is automatically deprived of their vote with the current language of the law. I feel that this is unjust to the Primary Seat Holder. I believe that each seat holder may issue their vote, but only the only occasion where the Secondary Seat Holder's vote is recognized is when the Primary Seat Holder's vote remains as pending, and as such would allow for the Secondary Vote to count.

Before I jump to drafting up any legislature, I'd like to consult with the Governing Body on this topic, as it's something we need to discuss and suggest possible course(s) of action should we agree this needs to be changed.

Therefore this topic is now an open discussion to members of the WASC.

I agree that this should be changed, but what if the secondary seats had like say a "half" vote towards any topic they are permitted to cote on. Like say the primary seat holder votes before the secondary and the seconderay cannot vote but if the secondary votes before the primary it would equal a half vote if the primary votes on the topic as well.

Primary:first |secondary: no vote

Secondary:first=half vote | primary:full vote

Just my thoughts, should this be installed in your legislature then obvious changes would have to be made.

UnitedStatesOfScouting Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:15 am

Wirbanskia wrote:
UnitedStatesOfScouting wrote:Greetings WASC Members,

With the new "WASC Secondary Seats Act", any Secondary Seat Holder may elect to vote as soon as possible without even consulting their Primary Seat Holder, when they vote the Primary Seat Holder is automatically deprived of their vote with the current language of the law. I feel that this is unjust to the Primary Seat Holder. I believe that each seat holder may issue their vote, but only the only occasion where the Secondary Seat Holder's vote is recognized is when the Primary Seat Holder's vote remains as pending, and as such would allow for the Secondary Vote to count.

Before I jump to drafting up any legislature, I'd like to consult with the Governing Body on this topic, as it's something we need to discuss and suggest possible course(s) of action should we agree this needs to be changed.

Therefore this topic is now an open discussion to members of the WASC.

I agree that this should be changed, but what if the secondary seats had like say a "half" vote towards any topic they are permitted to cote on. Like say the primary seat holder votes before the secondary and the seconderay cannot vote but if the secondary votes before the primary it would equal a half vote if the primary votes on the topic as well.

Primary:first |secondary: no vote

Secondary:first=half vote | primary:full vote

Just my thoughts, should this be installed in your legislature then obvious changes would have to be made.

In my opinion, I think that a Secondary vote should be a full vote or no vote. Whether we want to simply make the Secondary an equal like the United States Senate or not is something I'm willing to entertain. Although I think that what I've suggested may be the best option for us.

Snarfian Federation Tue Feb 10, 2015 4:29 am

Your completly right Scouting you've got my support

UnitedStatesOfScouting Tue Feb 10, 2015 11:20 pm

If there are no objections, I will be drafting legislature in 24-48 hours.

Great Eurussia Tue Feb 10, 2015 11:36 pm

UnitedStatesOfScouting wrote:If there are no objections, I will be drafting legislature in 24-48 hours.

Eurussia is against. The WA Secondary Seats Act hasn't been fully tested yet since there is only one continent that has an occupied secondary seat.

UnitedStatesOfScouting Tue Feb 10, 2015 11:48 pm

Great Eurussia wrote:
UnitedStatesOfScouting wrote:If there are no objections, I will be drafting legislature in 24-48 hours.

Eurussia is against. The WA Secondary Seats Act hasn't been fully tested yet since there is only one continent that has an occupied secondary seat.

I understand that it hasn't been fully tested yet, but there is a clear problem. If a Secondary Seat Holder votes minutes after a legislation is proposed, then it deprives the Primary Seat Holder of issuing their vote. I don't see it as fair to the Primary Seat Holder.

Great Eurussia Wed Feb 11, 2015 12:01 am

UnitedStatesOfScouting wrote:
Great Eurussia wrote:
UnitedStatesOfScouting wrote:If there are no objections, I will be drafting legislature in 24-48 hours.

Eurussia is against. The WA Secondary Seats Act hasn't been fully tested yet since there is only one continent that has an occupied secondary seat.

I understand that it hasn't been fully tested yet, but there is a clear problem. If a Secondary Seat Holder votes minutes after a legislation is proposed, then it deprives the Primary Seat Holder of issuing their vote. I don't see it as fair to the Primary Seat Holder.

It may be the case. But remember the reasons why SC members voted in favor of the law. It is to promote further activity and engagement within the SC. The simple voting procedure is up to each continent on how will they utilize it. It is up to them to cooperate or not on whom to vote first. Or if they can't agree, politics will rise and more engagements will happen within the continent. It also keeps the pressure on primary seat holders when their secondary seat holders are watching their performances so a request cannot be made asking for a switching of seats. We stand on these notions.

Serenarea Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:50 am

UnitedStatesOfScouting wrote:
Great Eurussia wrote:
UnitedStatesOfScouting wrote:If there are no objections, I will be drafting legislature in 24-48 hours.

Eurussia is against. The WA Secondary Seats Act hasn't been fully tested yet since there is only one continent that has an occupied secondary seat.

I understand that it hasn't been fully tested yet, but there is a clear problem. If a Secondary Seat Holder votes minutes after a legislation is proposed, then it deprives the Primary Seat Holder of issuing their vote. I don't see it as fair to the Primary Seat Holder.

This is what I disagreed most about the proposal and why I was against it at first.

UnitedStatesOfScouting Wed Feb 11, 2015 6:12 am

Serenarea wrote:
UnitedStatesOfScouting wrote:
Great Eurussia wrote:
UnitedStatesOfScouting wrote:If there are no objections, I will be drafting legislature in 24-48 hours.

Eurussia is against. The WA Secondary Seats Act hasn't been fully tested yet since there is only one continent that has an occupied secondary seat.

I understand that it hasn't been fully tested yet, but there is a clear problem. If a Secondary Seat Holder votes minutes after a legislation is proposed, then it deprives the Primary Seat Holder of issuing their vote. I don't see it as fair to the Primary Seat Holder.

This is what I disagreed most about the proposal and why I was against it at first.

When I read it, I simply miss-interpreted it. Originally I was against it because I honestly just didn't think we could fill the spots, since we were already having a tough time keeping people active. Eurussia was able to convince me to vote in favor though.

UnitedStatesOfScouting Wed Feb 18, 2015 9:22 am

I hereby close this discussion, we will bring this up again in the future once the system has had more time at use.

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